David and I were just listening to a Joe Rogan podcast featuring a man named Alan Graham who builds vibrant communities for the most hard-core homeless people. Along the way the subject of school paddlings came up.
They were discussing what changed over the past several decades to create the massive drug, crime, and homeless situation of today. Several things were discussed, and school paddlings were brought up in passing. Alan was making a broader point about social responsibility and mentioned he got the paddle. Joe also said he got the paddle in school in Florida.
Joe dutifully spewed all the liberal talking points about corporal punishment. Here was the exchange.
Alan: On my Facebook, which is my only social media deal, I'm a member of my high school thing, and one of our assistant principles recently passed away, Coach York, and there were 500-600 comments on Coach York and 90% of them were from men who got into his office and ended up being paddled, you know during that period of time, and talking about how awesome Coach York was, and I couldn't tell you how many licks I got from Coach York during that period of time because I was a little turdball when I was in Middle School and...
Joe: ...and that's what they used to do to kids, they used to paddle you
Alan: yeah used to paddle you
Joe: I got paddled when I lived in Florida
Alan: yeah well you can't, you can't be paddled anymore, there's no discipline you know
Joe: right I don't know if that's a good thing, though, to tell people that the way to discipline someone is to hit them. I don't think that's correct. I think that's a lazy approach. I think there's other ways to instill...
Alan: ...we have to learn how to discipline...
Joe: ....yeah you have to learn how to discipline. The problem is they're just dealing with large numbers of people and that's the fall back is to scare them and give them pain. The problem is you're encouraging people to hit other people and then you encourage it as a form of punishment and it's just not the way to go.
Alan: ...yeah I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm just, you know, saying that there was a different time and...
Joe: ...people were disciplined out of fear but, I think there's other ways to discipline people.
Here is the podcast. The above exchange took place 41 minutes in.
I think Alan conceded the point just to move on, as his main message was about his homeless communities. But I sensed he would support bringing the paddle back.
I personally don't think the paddle is necessary, but nor do I think it's harmful. Most kids respond to a talking-to just fine. My Dad's approach (after Mom outlawed spanking) was to take the misbehaving child away from others, sit down in a quiet spot, and provide a very calm and collected lecture (for the millionth time!) on why the behaviour was bad, why society has rules of behaviour, what it would be like if there were no such rules, about smoothing interpersonal relations, about getting people to like you and do good things for you, and so on, bloody ENDLESSLY! I remember my little six-year-old brother squirming on my Dad's lap as he received this very calm, intellectual lecture. I'm sure, intellectually, he understood little of it if any. But perhaps stuff like that gets embedded in your subconscious? At any rate, we knew exactly where the line was, and if you crossed it, you got taken away and lectured.
I was also of an age when before the ban, I got spanked. Once, when I was eight, I was gabbing ceaselessly when I should have been napping, and Daddy spanked me.
To me, those two experiences (lecturing and spanking) seem almost identical (except that one now makes my pussy tingle obscenely!). In both cases, I knew there was a line. I crossed it. I got consequenced.
I wasn't afraid of Daddy after my spanking. In fact, I was extra clingy to him afterwards, wanting to make 100% sure I was still loved.
It didn't teach me that it was okay to hit people. A spanking isn't hitting. It's discipline. It did teach me that little brats need spankings, though.
Was I scared of the pain? No. Though I remember every minute detail of that spanking, I have zero recollection of pain, though there must have been some. My predominant emotion was that I knew 100% that I had crossed a boundary and was being disciplined for it. Even at eight, I felt humiliated by the experience of needing to be disciplined for being naughty.
Can one go too far in corporal punishment? Of course! But we're not talking about clearly abusive things, we're talking about measured discipline.
How about school paddlings? A paddle that big and heavy can be too much. Mind, the kids are older and it's over clothes. But I would never give a spanking like that (and I am a bit of an expert).
It's much safer for any type of spanking, especially involving implements, to be given on the bare. You can see your target area clearly. You can see the results of your strokes.
For example, the below is the results of a real Texas school-type paddling delivered over the pants and panties. The bottom was bared afterwards to show the results. This guy is a super expert who has seen results like this many times, but an occasional amateur with zero such feedback could easily go too far.
Depending on the infraction, the above may not be too far, but I think the below is too far:
But if you're just whacking away over the clothes, and get zero visual feedback, how do you know? And those long heavy paddles should not be allowed, they are vicious.
I think paddlings should be over the knee and on the bare. Something more like this:
You can still make a very strong impression, but you'll know exactly where you're striking and the effect it has, and you can stop when the point is made, not relying on crocodile tears from the miscreant. I've been very effectively paddled over the knee myself. I speak from experience! It's never my tears that stop it, it's the state of my bum.
I think it's most effective if men do the paddling for either sex. But to up the humiliation factor for the boys, and for the safety of the girls, a female monitor should always be present. Female paddlers would be fine also, but I think it makes more of an impression on girls especially if a male authority figure does it ("Daddy" vibes). Let me know your thoughts on this point in the comments.
Yes, schools are assembly lines, and you may be inheriting a child with a history of lack of discipline, so assembly line discipline is called for.
The rules should be crystal clear and well-posted. Then if a rule is broken with inadequate excuse, a paddling should be given, no further questions asked. Children and teens respond well to boundary-setting, and there's no better boundary delineation than a firm bare-bum paddling in front of a witness.
Personally I would want this to be something a parent handles themselves, there are more than enough creepy teachers out there these days to make the idea of any of them paddling a child give me the willies. That being said I have never disagreed that spanking is an effective deterrent for kids, though as you yourself mentioned the lectures and talking can be just as effective punishment, the trick is a little bit of column A and B.
ReplyDeleteWell, nowadays it's only creepy lefties who are allowed to teach so I woukd agree!
DeleteAgree always on the bare and punishment spankings should always be in public. All through history this has been the case. Better deterrence that way.
ReplyDeleteWell... maybe a historical exageration?
DeleteEvery house should have a notorious spanking item. In ours it was a big thick wooden spoon. Mum would wield it and always on the bare. Fine to watch your siblings catch it but not so great when you were over the knee.
ReplyDeleteAgreed! My Mom also had the wooden spoon as a threat though it was never used.
DeleteI agree that the whole psychological harm thing is overblown. It all depends on if the parent is abusive or not. A bad parent/teacher can be abusive without touching the kid, through angry, hateful, harmful words and neglect. On the other hand, if a good parent/teacher that truly has the best interests of the kid at heart reinforces their boundaries with a paddling (which, let's face it, doesn't hurt that much - you, and many of us reading this blog, get paddled routinely with effectively zero damage), I can't say that's wrong. I doubt there's a person out there with loving parents who spanked who thinks it did them any harm, and many who would praise their upbringing that way. And, if it contributes to creating spankos like us? All the better!
ReplyDeleteWell said! 100%
DeleteA good paddling in front of witnesses can put you back on the right path. The memory I have of it is there forever.
ReplyDeleteI was 15 years old and had tried to look up two young teachers's skirts and the headmaster called my dad to ask him for permission to paddle me. Dad asked what I had done and then decided that the headmaster shouldn’t paddle me, rather Dad would come to school and give me what I deserved. I was usually a well-behaved boy that had never been paddled in school and I was happy that the headmaster couldn’t paddle me. Little did I suspect of what was coming. When Dad arrived he told me that he was the one going to spank me and said everyone could stay in the room (the 2 female teachers were there)
In front of the head and both teachers, my dad sat down on a chair, grabbed me, and yanked me over his knees. He pulled my trousers and my witties down to my ankles and picked up the wooden paddle from his coat's pocket. I don’t know how many strokes I got but it was between 35–40 on each butt cheek. I was howling and kicking with my legs like crazy. Afterward, I had, still wailing, to apologize to the two teachers and the headmaster said that Dad could take me home for the rest of the day. With my Dad's agreement and to my horror and to complete my punishment, the head kept my pants in his office and I could get them back the next day.
Dad took my hand and led me out of the office and through the school while I was still wailing hysterically with my one hand on my sore butt, the other in Dad’s hand. In dad’s other hand, he kept the paddle in full display for everyone to understand what happened.
I don’t know what could be more devastating to a 15-year-old boy than this. I heard later that my howls had been heard clearly in the corridor and no one had ever heard screaming and crying like that in school and it was a 15-year-old who sounded like 5 year old. The next day several boys and girls slapped my bottom and asked me if I could sit while grinning. I am sure this spanking contributed to me being a spanko today.
That's an AMAZING story! You certainly deserved everything you got, you little perv! 😉
DeleteHow did you attempt the upskirt view?
DeleteI was obsessed with women's knickers and constantly tried to look up women's skirts. I knew it was wrong but I couldn't help myself. I knew that one day I would be caught but I didn't believe it, I had developed techniques. When I spotted a short skirt, I would bend down to retie my laces or calculate paths to be behind the girl at the right time.
DeleteThe two young teachers were going down a staircase with openwork and I had developed a strategy that consisted of slipping under the stairs. I just had to look up at the right time. The view that presented itself to me made me forget all caution. I was on the verge of seeing how their cracks swallowed their panties... but I stayed too long staring under their skirts. A hand grabbed my ear and pulled me towards him, asking what I thought I was doing there... and the world fell apart. You know the rest.
Are you too an upskirt chaser ? Have you either been punished for that?
I just published a new fiction story based on your story. Hope you enjoy it!
DeleteWell, the harmful effects of physical violence against children (or any non-consenting person for that matter) is well researched and documented. But hey, let's not disturb you all in your kink fantasy world. I am sure a group of anonymous internet spankos dreaming of fucking their nieces and get assfucked by their own father is much more sensible and educated in this topic. 🥴
ReplyDeleteI think if you look into it you'll find it has not been proven. All the studies I've seen, and I've looked into it, fail to distinguish loving and reasonable discipline from abuse.They lump a spanking in with a punch in the face. Don't be so sure of yourself until you've looked into this point.
DeleteOn my blog, I'm always a little surprised at just how universal the rejection of corporal punishment for kids is, even though many of us experienced it personally and turned out to be successful, well-adjusted (well, mostly) adults. I'm not someone who goes around screaming that we must return corporal punishment to schools, but I also do think that the people who argue about all the damage it supposedly did to past generations need to explain how it is that the current school-age generation and the one before it experienced virtually no school paddlings, and yet teenage depression, anxiety, suicidal ideation, etc. are off the charts.
ReplyDeleteI've also reviewed several of the studies that purport to show the harms attributable to spanking on later life outcomes like graduation rates, income, etc. The fact is, in most of the studies, the supposed negative impact is extremely minor. Moreover, most of the studies lump all spanking together, such that a swat with an open hand is in the same category as true abuse that would constitute a criminal offense under every state's penal code. When you lump in punishment that is unquestionably criminal child abuse, *of course* you are doing to see a negative impact on life outcomes. Finally, virtually none of these studies address the obvious "chicken and the egg" problem -- did spanking a kid cause them to be an adult with conduct problems, or did a kid with conduct problems that carried through to adulthood get spanked a lot because they were a problem kid?
Anyway, my bottom line is, I think the jury is out on whether corporal punishment in schools has negative consequences, and I do think there is a case to be made that one reason we have declining school performance is a lack of discipline.
As for me personally, I remember distinctly being sent to the principal's office twice, for what I assumed would be a paddling. I somehow got out of it both times, so I guess I was as prone to arguing back then as I am now.
Yes, I agree. I think the important missing ingredient is discipline with love. Set boundaries and follow through. Whether the discipline is a mild spanking or a good talking to I think is a very secondary thing. A loving boundary setting parent who spanks will have a much more positive impact on a child than a parent who sets no boundaries IMO.
DeleteTotally agree. Without getting too into exploring my own kink origins, I grew up with very few boundaries, and none that were actually enforced by the time I was a teenager. At the time, it seemed to my friends like any teenager's wet dream. But, the reality was that when you have no boundaries, you are totally on your own when it comes to creating and bearing the weight of consequences, and that's pretty anxiety producing when you're a kid. I don't have any doubts that growing up without imposed boundaries is one reason I gravitate toward DD and FLR as an adult.
DeleteYes, there's something comforting about enforced boundaries, especially if they're at your request!
DeleteI got spanked at school when 9 years old for laughing when asked to spell the word bottom out loud in class.
ReplyDeleteShe should have made you spell the word 'spanking' afterwards!
DeleteI’m 32. When I was in middle school we had an older teacher (probably 50s…maybe early 60s) tell us a story about when she was a new teacher. She was in the school office.
ReplyDeleteThere was a kid sent to the principals office. The principal had decided a paddling was in order and called the boy’s parents. I don’t recall if mom or dad showed up, but apparently a secretary, the parent, child, and principal went into principals office.
She heard 3-4 swats followed by some yelps. Then the parent said “let me see that!” And she heard 8-10 more swats much louder this time followed by crying. It’s been 20+ years. I still recall that story.
-Alex G
Yup!
DeleteSo kids can’t be spanked at school because it’s harmful but they can be transgendered. Weird.
ReplyDeleteMaybe we should just have "S&M Awareness Month" and paddle away (just DON'T call it School or Domestic Discipline - LOL).
DeleteCarl H
Genius!
Delete"Now class, this month we're going to study a new sexual orientation called BDSM. Whenever you're naughty we'll do a demonstration."
My daughter is attending a woke university and at dinner said Joe Rogan is a gateway drug to far right politics. Maybe she needs a spanking?
ReplyDeleteYes, spank her! This will teach her to not have a different opinion than you and help her on the path to become an independent and strong adult! Can't make an omelette without breaking eggs!💪
DeleteI believe the original commenter was engaging in humorous sarcasm. I found it funny.
DeleteTo be fair, the (other) Anonymous was using humorous sarcasm too. It just was heavy handed, and so not funny. 21 swats. Heavy handed.
DeleteAnd here I thought heavy-handedness is something we all crave and enjoy here. :-(
DeleteBut the second one isn't funny unless the first one is being serious...
DeleteI completely agree with you about paddling in the schools. The teachers and administrators need to have the option of corporal punishment. I also agree with you about it being on the bare bottom. As you note, it is much safer because you can see the effects. It also helps with aim so you do not paddle too high or too low. Of course, being bared is embarrassing, but that is part of the punishment. Naturally, some bruising is going to occur. Everyone bruises differently, so it will be difficult to predict the effects. I am actually ok with the picture you thought went too far if the paddling was for a serious offense and was done as an alternative to explusion (such as fighting). However, I realized reasonable minds can differ on the level of severity and bruising. I also agree with you that girls being spanked need female witnesses to avoid any abuse. I also agree with you that those really huge heavy paddles should not be used. With the proper safeguards, school paddlings can be safe and effective.
ReplyDeleteWell said!
Delete